Question about Mercury Racing motors?

[GRADS]

....And showing that you spend more on your trailer than the two boats in it doesn't help either.

..................and - if either of those were jets, it would help make your point.

[FormulaZR]

....And showing that you spend more on your trailer than the two boats in it doesn't help either.

You I/O guys irritate me sometimes. But, in this case - you *might* have a point.

[Havasuing]

If you're thinking about installing a new 500+HP engine in a new boat (with a 2013 or 2014 HIN) your choices are extremely limited -- only three marine engine manufacturers currently have emission certified engines over 500 HP (Mercury, Ilmor and Teague). For the past couple of years other independent engine builders have continued to build and sell new 500+ HP engines in violation of EPA and CARB regulations on the 'down-low'. Up until recently, enforcement has been very minimal, but that is changing and small engine builders are beginning to be checked and when they are found in violation the fines are hefty, so much so that they would likely put them out of business. Don't think for a minute that Mercury Racing isn't getting a premium price for that certification. If you buy a new boat with a non-emissions certified new engine, the buyer is likely to have an issue/problem when it comes time to register the vessel (more states are beginning to crack down at time of registration). Unless the engine is specifically designated for racing/competition only, it better have the low-emissions certification sticker and paperwork to go with it.

[gn7]

If you're thinking about installing a new 500+HP engine in a new boat (with a 2013 or 2014 HIN) your choices are extremely limited -- only three marine engine manufacturers currently have emission certified engines over 500 HP (Mercury, Ilmor and Teague). For the past couple of years other independent engine builders have continued to build and sell new 500+ HP engines in violation of EPA and CARB regulations on the 'down-low'. Up until recently, enforcement has been very minimal, but that is changing and small engine builders are beginning to be checked and when they are found in violation the fines are hefty, so much so that they would likely put them out of business. Don't think for a minute that Mercury Racing isn't getting a premium price for that certification. If you buy a new boat with a non-emissions certified new engine, the buyer is likely to have an issue/problem when it comes time to register the vessel (more states are beginning to crack down at time of registration). Unless the engine is specifically designated for racing/competition only, it better have the low-emissions certification sticker and paperwork to go with it.

You do realize that ONLY applies to boats sold and registered in CALIF. and only applies to engine UNDER a certain power. It was originally under 500, it has been raised to under 600. You will notice the 600 and up Merc Racing ARE NOT EPA and CARB certified, because their is no certification for 600 and up engines. There are EPA standards that cover all 50 states, but they are weak compared to the CARB emission standards. Virtually any EFI engine can meet the EPA standards.
So Phaff, GT, and every other Tom Dick and Harry with a tool box can sell 600+ engines all he likes.
For the cost of a Merc 565, I can easily afford to buy 1000HP from damn near anybody else.

But for now, the EASIEST way around it is get out your own tool box and built it yourself. There NO LAW that states the boat has to meet any regs, only that the boat builders cannot sell boats with non certified engines. Says nothing about what I can build.

[Havasuing]

The EPA marine engine emission law (although somewhat less strict than CARB regulations) is now effective in all 50 states, and whether the engine is able to pass the test or not must still go through the prescribed testing protocol in order to receive certification (regardless of horsepower). California was ahead of the curve in passing marine emission laws by a couple of years, but EPA has now caught up. The Teague series of engines (825, 985/1025, 1200 and 1335 HP) are CARB certified as low-emisssion (3 star) engines and approved for California sale. The Mercury Racing and Ilmor high horsepower engines fall into a different catgeory ('large' manufacturers as opposed to a 'small' builder like a GT, Pfaff, etc.) They are using emission "credits" accrued from their production of lower horsepower engines to allow the sale of the high performance products. It's way more complicated than it probably needs to be, but John McKnight at NMMA has a good handle on this and of course you can always call CARB at the El Monte office and ask for Jeff Lowery or Kevin Curley for specific questions, both are quite helpful. And you are correct -- homebuilt engines are an entirely different matter and are still unrestricted.

[gn7]

The EPA marine engine emission law (although somewhat less strict than CARB regulations) is now effective in all 50 states, and whether the engine is able to pass the test or not must still go through the prescribed testing protocol in order to receive certification (regardless of horsepower). California was ahead of the curve in passing marine emission laws by a couple of years, but EPA has now caught up. The Teague series of engines (825, 985/1025, 1200 and 1335 HP) are CARB certified as low-emisssion (3 star) engines and approved for California sale. The Mercury Racing and Ilmor high horsepower engines fall into a different catgeory ('large' manufacturers as opposed to a 'small' builder like a GT, Pfaff, etc.) They are using emission "credits" accrued from their production of lower horsepower engines to allow the sale of the high performance products. It's way more complicated than it probably needs to be, but John McKnight at NMMA has a good handle on this and of course you can always call CARB at the El Monte office and ask for Jeff Lowery or Kevin Curley for specific questions, both are quite helpful. And you are correct -- homebuilt engines are an entirely different matter and are still unrestricted.

The are 6 ways to skin a cat, and half of them are done every day by engine builders selling engines for boats.
There are loop holes in the law, and I have no doubt the gestapo will close them all in time. Its the American way to squeeze the little guy any way they can. Whether its a small builder, or a do it yourselfer. They will find a way to outlaw it. Its not the industry and sport it was in the 60s. The boats, the builders, and the people involved on both sides, builders and consumers have drastically changed. I look at this period as the "muscle car" period of the 60s. Before that you had to built a fast car, then you just wrote a check. Then they disappeared. We are currently in the "just write a check" phase in boating.