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I don't give a fuck if its if its turned a pre WWI lath, its the guy standing at it. What fuck do I care what the end of it looks like on the rack. I helped Bob load a shipment of material on to those racks years ago. You think the shit from the mill had polished ends???? Look like it had been cut off with giant bolt cutters. So the fuck what!!!
BTW, I watched Bob make my shaft, and it never went into some freek'n chucker for the threads,
Coffee stat! LolQuote:
Originally Posted by gn7
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well hate to tell you BOB is dead and there guy STEVE is clueless i watched him try to shorten my rudder stuffing box before he trashed it and Vicky was nice enough to sell me a replacement for 1/2 price since she has no control of the machines. and i watched the latin guy in the shop cut the taper on a shaft than move it to a chucker and cut the end and the threads , than go to a broaching tool and cut the keyway. I do Admit BOB was the man if he made one with a rock aim sure it would be fine , but BOB is gone!Quote:
Originally Posted by gn7
so it looks like that Bob has ruled out that the machine used isn't the problem its the guy running the machineQuote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
A WW1 lathe will make the same shaft a brand new CNC lathe can.
here is my rudder stuffing box that Glenwood marine shortened for me after i bought it for 82.50, vicky charged 15 bucks to cut it offAttachment 37746Attachment 37747Attachment 37748, the machinists walked to me and said uuummmm thats some exotic material you have there , i said idk just bought it up front looks like cast brass or bronze, he rolled his eyes and said its very exotic,and handed me the destroyed part i just bought, i walked back to the front and Vicky said when machining a customers part they have supplied they have no guarantee and it being a very exotic material shit happens , than Steve added in i break at least 10 cutting tools a day working on this highly exotic material, so she offered to sell me one for 42.00 bucks and no tax. I came home and cut it off with a hacksaw in about two minutes and filed the end flat..it a a worn out hack saw blade and a shitty old file , it had no problems cutting this soft material with..
in short there machinist charged 15 bucks to destroy a 80 dollar part to sell another for 40 ....lesson learned at glenwood.
and aim going to trust them making a prop shaft out of actual exotic material when they struggle with brass and bronze????
You know, I try to help you where ever I can, and if I remember correctly, I was the one that guided you Marine Machine, but sometimes you are simply way too fucking stupid to bother with.Quote:
Originally Posted by ogshotgun
i appreciate your help, i was making a point in the beginning both you and kevin were all about the machine and the surface speed to tip being constant , than in the end you say it doesn't fn matter at all.. make up your mind..does the machine make any difference or not ? a old ww1 lathe has about 6 speeds and maybe two feed speeds, the reason why they break at least 10 cutting tools a day and trash 50% of the parts, this is all after BOB has passed away, and i found Marine machine on my own gave Kevin the web site to make sure there up to the standards needed and he agreed,Quote:
Originally Posted by gn7
marine machine vs glenwood
is like a rock vs a bazooka
also iam not fucking STUPID , stupid people just listen to all the BS and never ask a question. intelligent people ask questions to gain knowledge.. i ask a lot of questions.
Well this thread is going nicely.
Lets please keep the name calling to a minimum. While I understand the need to pop off on occasion, please try to make more general statements. For example: Not all machinists are brain surgeons. My monel is better than your monel. My WWII lathe will machine better than your CNC lathe. Even my shaft is harder than your shaft is ok. LOL
But lets try to keep pet references out of the equation.
if you want to use my quote use the whole thingQuote:
Originally Posted by gn7
"well hate to tell you BOB is dead and there guy STEVE is clueless i watched him try to shorten my rudder stuffing box before he trashed it and Vicky was nice enough to sell me a replacement for 1/2 price since she has no control of the machines. and i watched the latin guy in the shop cut the taper on a shaft than move it to a chucker and cut the end and the threads , than go to a broaching tool and cut the keyway. I do Admit BOB was the man if he made one with a rock aim sure it would be fine , but BOB is gone!"
i wasn't calling any names and if some one is clueless well thats my opinion, but did not use any bad wordsQuote:
Originally Posted by Hotboat
Think about this rocket scientist. Did I send you to Glenwood for your shaft, EVEN KNOWING full well that's where I got mine, and knowing full well they made ever single shaft Rudy ever used in a marathon boat, even after Rudy and Andy Casale (who will make a shaft if you ask VERY nicely) both told me to go to Glenwood.Quote:
Originally Posted by ogshotgun
Now stick that genius brain in gear, and ask your self REAL SLOW and CLEARLY, why did Bob tell to get the shaft at MM&M? Did I EVER suggest you get the shaft at Glenwood? WHY THE FUCK NOT????
Now I have no intention of running a Q22 shaft, from MM&M or Burgeron. If I need a new shaft, it will most likely be another K Monel, but not from Glenwood. I MIGHT purchase the material there to stream line matters. But I will take it somewhere.
I would have told you do the same thing, but seriously, I don't care to risk burning bridges with every Tom, Dick and Harry that needs a shaft. And your last few posts definitely placed you in the category. I don't suffer fools lightly, and many people I know don't either. I don't need someone calling me saying WTF were you thinking sending that guy here.
Specially the comment about Bob being dead. Might as well told me Rudy and my dad were as well.
so i asked Glenwood to send me a picture of how they cut the taper on there prop shafts ...what i got back is this please follow along
Hello there Thanks for inquiring about our prop shafts , i will try to answer your question, we used this set up for many years see attached photoAttachment 37750
than in the last ten years we upgraded to the modern set up in the next photoAttachment 37751 Hope this answers your questions
Regards Vicky
notice the date on the brochure 1944
didn't know if you knew Bob has died . many people did not Know he's not around any more..it was a fyi for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by gn7
i have my shaft and it will work fine, some guy came on here bad mouthing the Aquamet 22 and than bob started in saying his 99 cents worth and its been going since, now he says a ww1 lathe will produce the same shaft as a new high end cnc lathe will.. now aim going out of my way to prove him wrong..and he never mentioned Marine Machine i found them on my own...Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
i understand that .. so you agree a WW1 lathe will produce the same part as a brand new CNC will? with the same person running it that is?
one machine is over 70 years old it will produce the exact same quality of part as a new machine, as long as the operator is up to par?
I don't think so.
News flash, long before there were CNC machines people were making precision parts. My grandfather was a gear maker, and was one of the finest in the country according to the people that sought him out long after he retired. When computers first came on the scene they used to get the best engineers they could find to walk them through the process so they could get the machine to do it the same way. I remember they called him out of retirement to help them make a gear for a giant shovel (used at strip mines, looked like a house on a turn table). My grandfather said they had programming engineers watching everything he did, and how he bets that somewhere there is a computer that stops and scratches it's imaginary nose before moving to the next step.Quote:
Originally Posted by ogshotgun
The point is, the old equipment is just as capable as the new fancy stuff with the right operator. The new stuff is faster and easier to duplicate the same part over and over. And the new stuff doesn't require the same level of skill from the operator, just from the programmer. The new stuff also repeats the same mistakes over and over if they were programmed in, or something becomes out of tolerance.
You'd be amazed at how many people can't do a simple task like turn a brake rotor because they can't grasp the concept of to big a cut or a dull bit. And when you apply it to turning a exotic metal the number of people that can't goes up drastically. And there is more to metal work than just how it looks when it is done, so I'll take GN7's advice when he says this shop knows what they are doing. I also trust people that work with these metals to school us. I know the precision that Westernaero has to meet on aircraft as well as seeing some of the great stuff he is turning out. This site is fortunate to have the people with real world experience and top notch skills.
didn't miss anything i agree the operator of the machine is where it begins , but i also do know that a process used 50 years ago was fine 50 years ago but times have changed and motors have changed since 1944 and materials have changed and more exotics available today than in 1944, i do remember you saying to machine this material you need a constant surface to cutter speed at all times so it must be done on a cnc machine.Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
the tool used at the other shop is nothing more than a pencil sharpener basically, i can not see the same quality coming off the two different machines . in fact my old shaft from the old supplier has chatter marks on the taper running length wise from the pencil sharpener tooling thats being used
i agree and the pencil sharpener tool was a upgrade 10 years ago! its what they use today.Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
its what is used on Kmonel and Aquamet 19, they don't sell 22Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO
call me i have a quick question and don't need everyones opinions and bs on how to do it, i trust you and bob, and he's mad.Quote:
Originally Posted by WESTERNAERO